Chris breaks down how he’s wholesaled 8000+ properties in his career and how he’s lent over one billion dollars in private lending.
Watch the whole interview at www.realestatedisruptors.com/video/interview-with-chris-eymann/
Chris breaks down how he’s wholesaled 8000+ properties in his career and how he’s lent over one billion dollars in private lending.
Watch the whole interview at www.realestatedisruptors.com/video/interview-with-chris-eymann/
Chris Eymann Shares How He’s Sold Over 8000 Homes and Lent Over One Billion Dollars!
Video Replay of Interview with Chris Eymann
Podcast Replay of Interview with Chris Eymann
00:00:00 Hey everybody, thank you for joining us for today’s episode of real estate disruptors. Today we’ve got the legendary Chris Eymann with sell wholesale houses and he’s here to share how his company has moved over 8,000 properties and lent over half a billion dollars in private lending. If this your first time tuning in, I’m Steve Trang, broker, owner of Stunning Homes Realty, cofounder of the fast app, the only app you’ll need for wholesaling. And I help people become real estate entrepreneurs. If you’re excited for today’s show, please give me some waves or some thumbs up. And before we get started, I started this show because I want to get back to our community. Uh, I definitely had some struggles and very beginning of my career and I’m sure you faced some struggles. You’re a very long career. Uh, and so we want a shortcut that struggle for as many young leaders as possible. I don’t charge a dime for this show. I don’t make any money doing this. So here’s all I ask. This is all it costs for you to listen to this show. If you get value, please tell a friend. Either share this episode right now, tiger from below, or telling your best takeaway from this show later on. That way we can all grow together. Uh, don’t forget that this is a live show. So please post your questions for Chris to answer. Are you ready? Ready. Let’s go. All right. What got you into real estate?
00:01:11 I’m actually was a tech guy, worked for Phillips Petroleum, couple other companies and during the tech downturn got laid off twice in the same year. Um, that lovely conference room call where it’s. Hey Chris in the conference room, here’s your check through an extra couple of weeks on there. And that was it. That was what year? It was 98, 99. And uh, I jumped into that was right around the.com bus. Okay. And then, uh, jumped into the two week class for real estate, um, drove around a buyer for three weeks and had her call me on week four and said, oh, I just called off a sign and that agent got me a house. And uh, I went down the foreclosure steps, been going ever since.
00:01:56 So it wasn’t that long from when you were licensed to screw it? Yeah, pretty much. Pretty much a couple of months, couple of months work my buyer and the Africa. Okay. Uh, so, uh, after that. So you went straight into auction? Yep. Dot Auction. So then did you do wholesale first or did you private lending first?
00:02:14 No, so I started buying at the auction steps. I just buying from my own account, Rehab and I’m selling them. Um, but you know, networking got me, we’re watching football, I’m telling you that I’m buying the auctions and this is before anybody’s buying at the auctions, right? This is, yeah, 99. So I’m literally it, it didn’t take like six to eight months by the time I’m buying one, you know, calling everybody up or actually they’re calling me and they’re like, what’d you buy today? And I’m like about one, two, three main street. I bought it for 100 grand. You can have for 100 to bring the two grand in cash. But that was, that was pretty much the wholesale and I was wholesaling within a year of, you know, of starting in real estate. Okay. So this is 1999 slash 2000. Yeah. Basically. Okay. So you’re wholesaling and what was the process?
00:03:06 What was that journey like from, you know, baking that 2000 on a deal to what mean your next, what was the next junction? Um, so I, uh, I was just kinda like an independent. Um, then I joined a group. I’m buying foreclosures. There were three of us in that group. Uh, and no, there was two main groups down at the truck, at the trustee sales, Andy Who’s in my coaching business with me. What was one of the groups? And then you know, me and a couple of other guys are in the other group and just graduate in each other every day for six years. So you guys were doing buying auction courthouse steps for six years and we’re just wholesaling right? This is before any bid services. This is just buy on your own account, mark it up, three grand, five grand, 20 grand, whatever you can get away with.
00:04:00 Um, and wholesale, who are you wholesaling it to you? I’m just, you know, buyers. Back then it wasn’t nice text blasts, it was just all email blast. Um, you know, I was back then email blast would work. Email blasts was the only way to distribute and then you could, you know, do some cold calling and people called you. Um, but there wasn’t even texting you back then. Right? It’s just email blast. Okay. And then what got you into private money lending? Um, so in about 2003, I met a couple guys that had a couple of truckloads of money and uh, there they came to me and like, hey, I was borrowing hard money myself and they’re like, Hey, you know, borrow my money and instead of paying another guy’s just borrow my money and then you can lend it out and make the spread. Um, so I started doing that.
00:04:51 No three, I’m the guy that I was borrowing hard money from a big piece of his business going away. Next thing I know, um, we had a $25,000,000 line of credit with wells fargo that went to $100,000,000. Oh, nice. Probably had $100,000,000 line by. Oh, five I think. Okay. So money wasn’t taught yet at that time? Yeah, they’re given out $100,000,000 line of credit. Yeah. Now that’s great. That sounds awesome. So you would, he would borrow from wells, you lend it to you and he will make that spread. Oh, I was also on the wells line. So you’re also in the Wellesley. Yeah. Also signed that personal guarantee that went along. Okay. So then you guys are making the spread between what you guys are brought from wells solar at prime plus two. And we are lending at 18. This was before everybody was in hard money, right? Yeah. Yeah. 18 was. I still remember the first time I was at an event back in 2007. Yeah. I was like 18 percent, right. What’s going on here? Plus the thousand dollar fee, what? Who would agree to this? Now I know a lot of people agree to it, right? Uh, okay. So you got into the private lending. What were some of your early
00:05:58 struggles then on the prime? On the private lending side,
00:06:01 there wasn’t a lot of early struggles. This is, this is way before everybody’s in the business. Everybody’s in the money business, in the wholesale business. I mean everybody now it’s then it was just two groups and we can, we basically controlled the whole city. Oh really? And as far as hard money lenders, there were, there were more hard money lenders. There’s probably three or four, but um, I mean our portfolio is 80 million bucks. Wow. So. And loans are turning over, so I mean it’s a, you said put $500, million. I don’t actually know. We’re turning over $80,000,000 every 100. Twenty to 130 days. Wow. For years. So yeah. I mean do the math on that. That’s $240,000,000 a year.
00:06:40 Yeah. So you’re probably over a billion then lent in your career. I just didn’t want to. Okay. So, um, then the recession occurred, right? So you started during the tech bust, there was 9:11 you say like, that really affects you so much and then you went through and had this great growth that we’re like similar to what we’re experiencing today. And then the recession hit
00:07:04 right? What weekly wasn’t a recession? It was the secondary money are the secondary market quit buying paper. So like she can’t sell paper, you can’t read, originate a loan and if you’re a hard money lender and there’s no recourse, they just start handing back the keys.
00:07:21 Right? Yeah. So, but you were still borrowing, you know, whatever, the hundred million dollar line of credit where you, was that close to you or would that still maintain open the whole time? Uh,
00:07:30 no. So it, um, we would, we would borrow $100,000 from, we’d lend $100,000 welded by 90 percent of that. And then you have these covenants or rules that you have to follow. I see. But as your foreclosure rate grows, because you know, if the secondary market can’t buy paper, you’re a fix and flipper that has a hard money loan, but the guy buying your house can’t get along, so no one can sell a house. Yeah, right. So, you know, wells Fargo, as soon as you get outside the rules, they just lock your bank account now and you got no money. So then what did you do in that situation? Oh, you just a, we came asset manager, we foreclosed on quite a bit of houses. Um, you know, dealt with them I think, I think 2007, eight and nine were dealt with, you know, doing a lot of that.
00:08:25 Um, and then I went out. So taking over property is that you guys lead time for a fix and flip guys. Right. Okay. So did a lot of that. That wasn’t actually my position in the company. Um, and then I started another venture and you know, went back at it. So it was that other venture. Oh, sell wholesale houses. Okay. So that’s when he became another wholesaling entity. So there was two of those. Buy Easy foreclosures and then what was the other one that’s so sell wholesale houses. So when the our group, when the downturn hit, we just kind of all went our own different
00:08:56 ways. Right. And then so sell wholesale houses pretty much started in oh seven. Oh eight. And then from there. And as you buy yourself A. I have my sisters, my partner, his sister, his sister Kim mud. Okay. She’s the one because I noticed she’s, she’s listed if you have your properties. Yeah. Yeah. That makes a broker. Gotcha. That makes a lot of sense. All right. Okay. So you had to shift your business in that time. He became an asset manager. Started unfortunately to take over properties. But you were, you were still on the hook, right? W with personal guarantee. Personal guarantee. Yeah. I lost everything. He lost everything. Yeah. So you were one of the guys and like, yeah, these guys were losing their properties, but you also losing your properties. My tax return said negative four point 2 million bucks. That’s all. Just that explains it a four point two and we’re able to carry that loss forward at least.
00:09:47 Oh yes, so there’s a win there. There’s some small wins, small wins. Okay. So knowing what you know today, what will you do differently? Um, if you’re starting over, like right now? No personal guarantees, no personal guarantees. Right. Okay. Um, and then obviously, you know, wash the market. Um, yeah, I was a little bit leveraged. I was having fun, I was making a lot of money, right. And right. And I had made a lifestyle that was off making a lot of money. I make pretty good money and my lifestyle is almost all cash. Yeah. So you a little bit less leveraged today than you were back then? Yes. Okay. Uh, so private lending is extremely competitive in Phoenix today. I actually met with a lender today and she shared with me that they’re in multiple states, but she enjoys North Carolina the most because they are, you can charge two points and get 14.
00:10:41 Right. It’s like, wow. Yeah. You can’t get away with that here. No. So how do you set yourself apart in Phoenix with private lending? You know, I don’t, I just keep building the network and everybody’s going to get their piece of the Pie. Yeah. I’m, I’m not going to chase down rates for business. Um, you know, I don’t have bank lines so I don’t have any personal guarantees and I’m not going down that road again. So. And I’m also not going to chase down lowering my down payment and risking it because it’s real estate cycles, right? Yeah, it does. I’ve been through the Rodeo one time. I’m not going through it again. Right. So, um, yeah, if, uh, if my portfolio shrinks, but, but I got a really great portfolio. I’m great with that. I got no problems. So if you don’t mind sharing, like what is like, you know, I got this great deal today, Chris, I’ve got a 70 percent of market value. I bring it to you. What am I borrowing it at? I’m generally 15 to 20 percent down. I stretched below that every now and then if you’re getting a really good deal, but generally it’s, you know, because if you don’t have any, you know, I saw, I think I saw a five percent down recently. I’ve definitely seen 10 a lot. If you have the
00:11:54 ability to just walk away, just walk away. Yeah, I mean it’s no recourse state. There is no recourse now there’s, you just walk away, right. So, um, you know, and I, I’ve seen a little bit of a, the first part of people trying to get away with that down payment. This buddy. So onto this buddy, you know, I really, I caught one of those four days ago this base on this buddy, you know, assignment fee of 15 grand and their down payments. 15 grand, you know. I see. Okay. And what are your, what are your rates right now on the 15 percent? Ten percent. Fifteen percent down is 14 percent. Twenty percent down as twelfth. Okay. So that’s not, it’s not bad. Yeah. Okay. So, but what will you tell someone you know, they’re like, Hey Chris, I’m looking at you. I’m looking to option B, I’m looking after and see, and I, I say, why should I go with you?
00:12:42 What do you say? I’m just saying we’ve been in the business a long time. Um, we’re pretty reliable. I’m, but I won’t chase down rate if. I mean I trust me. I get people like, Hey, they’ll do 11. I’m like, great, go get it. Yeah, I appreciate coming back to me next time when they run out of money or, or something doesn’t work. I get or they’ll find on time. Yeah. It’s all economics, right? And I get it. Um, people need to make money and I’m not willing to chase down rate or down payment to, you know, try to get business. Right. And then same question, wholesaling. Yeah. Again, extremely competitive. If we’re not the most competitive wholesale market, I don’t know what it is. Everybody’s a wholesale on this market. Yeah, everyone’s a wholesale like today. So what sets you apart a competitively for wholesaling?
00:13:31 Why should someone else out with you or. Well, I’m, once again, I’m not a, I’m not a wholesaler that just is trying to assign every deal right? I got a $30,000,000 hard money company that I control, so if I need to fund, I can fund, right? We’ll all try to wholesale. I make mistakes. I buy too expensive every now I’m not perfect, but at least I have the cash to pay for it. When the time comes, other wholesalers don’t have the cash to pay for it. So, um, I mean, that’s the benefit of working with me. If I say I’m buying it, I’m buying it. So, so there’s no like, oh man, we can’t perform. Yeah, no, I’m in, I’m, I made mistakes. I uh, I did a deal that I bought and sometimes I mean to be competitive and beat people to the house.
00:14:19 I buy pictures 95 percent of the time. I don’t, I don’t get the walkthrough. So, uh, you know, I walked into a house that someone who sold me and I walked in through the front door and I’m just like, man. And I knew the second I walked in the House that I was losing money and I had a $5,000 earnest money. I just called my buddy and I’m like, Hey, can I just walk from the five grand, just go sell to somebody else, and that was, this is two weeks for clothes and he’s like, come on, it’s old guy. He’s already. And I’m just like, all right. I knew that I was losing more than five grand. I close on the house. I think I lost 10 or 11, but I mean I could have just walked from the earnest money. You could have saved myself five or six grand.
00:15:02 Yeah. What did you see when you walked in that you knew you were this money on that deal? It was a tri level so that you walked in the house, you walk down the right stairs, four steps into the living room and errors up into the dining room with the kitchen. Yeah. Now those try levels. The second I walked through the door, I’m like, all right. So, um, what does a good referral look like to you? I mean, anybody that get agents that, you know, don’t know all the other wholesalers in town. So hey, this guy buys houses. Um, I think I just got one in Old Town Scottsdale for 2:55, which you don’t see very often. No you don’t. So, um, and that was just an agent calling me saying, Hey, this guy wants to sell an old town, Scottsdale. I came across at 2:55. I’m like, yeah, grab it.
00:15:52 Right. Yeah. So someone that has a deal tied up and doesn’t know what to do with it or an agent that, you know, you walk in and they got 12 dogs or you know, they’ve never thrown one thing away for the 20 years I’ve lived there. Right. You know, all those agents that don’t have the referral. Once it gets to the wholesale group, I mean the price is just get lifted and lifted. Lifted. Right. It’s nuts. Yeah. Yeah. By the time you get to you, if someone, if there’s been a wholesaler or two along the way. Yeah, there’s nothing left, right? Yeah. Okay. Um, what do you attribute your success to you? I mean, you’ve been doing this for almost 20 years now. Like how have you had the staying power to still be in the, in the business? I mean, there’s so much change constantly.
00:16:39 How have you been able to stay on top of it? Well, it’s funny as I’m not as good as all the younger people in the business with social media and all that. Actually it was kind of funny. I read an email that said I want to make sure that the person coming to coffee is legit because I don’t want to waste my time. My, uh, I can’t attribute most of my successes if someone asks me to coffee. It’s five minutes. It’s 10 minutes. Yeah. I went to coffee with almost every verse when you called me and said, hey, be on my show. Would I say? Yeah. And how long have you taken me to say yes? Not Very Long. Yeah. So I mean, I don’t, I’ve gone title companies. I mean I did a foreclosure lunch and learns for realty executives I think every month for three or four years. Oh really? I just cycle their offices, their 16th street office there. Tempe office, you know, I did. I think, I dunno how many foreclosure classes I gave for fidelity national title, right? It’s just, but you get in front of 50, 60 people and you get to build your network and I don’t, I mean everybody these days bills it all on social media, right? I built it actually by getting cards.
00:17:50 So consistency and staying in front of people all the time. So, um, you talked about, uh, the, the courses. So that was actually one of my questions, how you intentionally stay in front of people because I heard a great story about you, right? We, we talked about earlier. So how do you consistently stay in front of people?
00:18:07 Um, you know, I just try to follow up. I’m a busy guy but I try to answer text messages, emails, probably my weakest link. But yeah, you know, um, and like I said, I’m in front of people right now on your show. I’m in front of him. I hit every happy hour that I get invited to. And you, and I’m not really a talkative person if you go see me in a happier, I sit in the corner,
00:18:29 but it’s like, who’s the tall guy? Right, right. So, because you were there. Yeah, I’m there. You’re available. Uh, and then, you know, uh, we first met through a fidelity mastermind, right. It’s been disbanded since, but that was a cool opportunity because I was like, oh, hey, that’s Chris. That’s, that’s the guy that sends out those emails with those discounted properties. Right, right. So definitely you’re, you’re, you’re putting yourself out there, making stuff available. Uh, so what is your organization look like today?
00:18:56 We still run a bid service. Um, are you guys still doing bis services? Yeah, we still do bid services. Know that UCF panel Maricopa, you have a pie and a pima. So we still do that. Obviously there’s not a lot of volume, but there’s still opportunities. Yeah. So opportunities and you know, we’re there. We’re staying in front of that group of people. Um, I, uh, we still wholesale, um, and then, you know, we do our hard money, but literally it’s a two assistants, a bookkeeper. Um, couple of bitters and a driver and me and my partners and so it’s my sister is my partner on paper, but tim and Kim mud or they’re married, been married for 25 years or 26 years.
00:19:44 There’s like four kids. Okay. So then going back to the auction, let’s say I buy a property at the courthouse steps, you know, Chris, I liked this property, I want to bid on it. Then obviously you’ll do the hard money loan on it on this as well. So we do the hard money for the auctions in the, you know, all the wholesale properties. Okay, cool. So that’s like a one stop shop, right? I don’t really need much else than that. I guess I need the 10,000 to put down. So we do the bid service and we do. We’d been with her own money. So you don’t have to, you don’t need the $10,000. Okay. Well that’s good. That’s good. All right. Um, so we talked about um, you know, you’re, you’re wholesaling, how many properties are you wholesaling? I’m on right now probably 20. 20. Okay. And how do you source your deals?
00:20:28 Um, we actually were, we got an in house so we do some cold calling and some letters. And then, you know, like you heard the story, like I could follow up with just the smaller wholesalers. I get on Monday, Wednesday, I just say, hey, you got anything new? Hey Guy. Anything new? I literally sit down there, I go to a breakfast place for coffee and I just start texting people. Yeah,
00:20:50 that’s a great system. So who are you calling or mailing to?
00:20:56 Um, no, we do it all. We hit the foreclosure list, we get the a probate list. We hit everybody that bought prior to 2000. I mean seamless everybody else or hit.
00:21:10 Yeah, pretty much. That’s the same list I’m heading, that’s for sure. So again, going back to my story earlier about asthma, so I went to Nigeria and like, man, these guys are charging 80 percent. How do they get away with it? This is, this is, you know, it feels like murder, right? Um, but on the flip side of that was like, boy, I would love to be in position to be able to lend 18 percent someday. So you missed that boat. I did miss that. Boat is a, is gonna be very tough to
00:21:35 today. All right. I do know some lenders that are 18, but they’re getting zero down.
00:21:39 Yeah. Yeah. So do you feel, I mean, I guess your actions probably speak already answered this question, but do you feel hard? Money is still where it’s at.
00:21:48 You know, it’s, the margins are obviously a lot thinner. I think lending in other states, you got a better opportunity, like you said about North Carolina. Fourteen and two points. I mean, if that rolls every six months, you’re really, it’s like 18 plus, right? Right. Because two points will turn into four points in a six month timeframe. Right? Yep. Um, so, but, you know, what I did learn, um, from a seven downturn is we got hurt more in the other areas that we were lending in and doing business in than we did in Phoenix. Even though sometimes phoenix to the hardest hit. But we understood it, we lent better at it. Um, so I, I’ve just staying here, why do you think he took a bigger punch in the gut outside of Arizona? Because we’re using salespeople that made, maybe didn’t understand the market as well as we understand the phoenix market.
00:22:43 Okay. Um, and so let’s say, let’s just say today, you know what, Chris, I like what you’re doing. I’m going to compete against you on become a hard money lender. What are the things I need to do?
00:22:56 Um, well, do you need to get some cash? Right? So finally guy with a big giant check book and make sure he trusts you. Um, you know, we roughly have $30, million dollars and it’s probably made up of about five to six people that trust me. Um, you know, in the downturn, you know, I went when I lost all that money and went negative about a million and a half. I spent from [inaudible] eight till about 2015 meeting all my friends and family back that million and a half. Didn’t file bankruptcy, didn’t pay them a dime worth of interest, but I paid them all back, so that’s awesome. I got a lot of people that will give me their checkbook, but. So, you know, that’s the first step. And then, you know, if you can go from there and get bank lines and all that kind of stuff because they’re actually coming, but they want to see, you know, years in the business and all that fun stuff.
00:23:50 Yeah, it makes sense. They want them to do this, some decent due diligence. Right. Um, okay. So, uh, I saw a presentation only say year and a half, maybe even two years ago now you and Andy and you guys had this program. You guys are rolling out Rei ground school. Yeah. Tell me about that. So, uh, it’s just basically a, a local educator. Um, obviously we got plenty of national educators. A lot of them just live here. They all live here in Phoenix, Phoenix, Scottsdale. Yeah. So, uh, we went with a more of a local program because Andy and I both have been born and raised in real estate in this market. So it’s more of a hands on training for guys that want to learn the business from not a national educator, more of a, you know, a guy in Phoenix that understands the market. So, um, it went really well.
00:24:43 Uh, but you know, all the big guys come in fortune builders and you know, and they spend just bunches and bunches of money to get it. I can’t get on facebook or instagram without seeing an ad. Right. Former bureau. Yeah. Right. I mean, and they’re here every week and I’m in between. I think there’s, you know, five to six big companies, fortune builders. So I don’t know who’s behind that one. Yeah, it’s cody. Yup. Because Dean Kiyosaki. Yeah, just nuts over here. Yeah. And you and they’re here every week and you go up against their fortune builders got like a $400,000,000 spend on facebook. My spend was like 40,000. They’re spending are not. Sorry. Yeah, 40,000. They’re spending $40, million or 4 million I think. Is there a budget? Like it’s ridiculous. Right. You know. And so, you know, it was a, it was a great opportunity. I’m actually, you know, was fun to actually give back and educate people and see them make money.
00:25:49 Um, we had some students absolutely crush it. Just awesome. Crush it like this one guy made and he’s 62 and he made like 200 grand in six months. That’s awesome. So watching that was, was pretty fun. And um, but just the economics of it just like wholesaling hard money. Everybody’s an educator now. Yeah. So then you’ve got, am I hearing that? It’s winding down. We are going to do another class in January. Um, but we’ve gone to a different marketing strategy that I’m not going to disclose, but okay. Because I think it’s a little different. Um, and won’t cost us as much money to do so therefore we can do it. We don’t have to have this huge giant venue we can still give back to the people that are really interested but don’t have to put, you know, when you have, when you spent $40,000 in marketing and a hotel venue and then you got your salespeople. I mean, you’ve got to break 100 grand, even make money and that doesn’t seem fun and I want to get back to where it’s fun and just people that want to learn about the phoenix market and how to be a 62 year old guy and make 200 grand in six months. I want that guy. Right? I don’t want to compete with all these, you know, big guys.
00:27:02 Oh No, that makes a lot of sense. I mean, that’s, that’s one of the things that, you know, I would love one day to build it, to be able to do that. But man, there are so many people doing it and it’s hard for a new wholesaler to know who’s real and who’s not. Right. I mean, how can they.
00:27:16 Yeah. I mean, you go to, um, I actually am buddies with a coach on the phone and he’s, he’s a wholesaler in town, but I mean, they go to these mass meetings and they pay their money and they’re talking to somebody across the country that’s getting paid whatever, 70, 75 bucks an hour to teach them how to wholesale. You know, all the students had joined my program, got a Thursday morning meeting with me from nine to 10:00 and I’m like, okay, what’d you do last week? Why didn’t you do it?
00:27:53 You know, don’t make excuses. Personal interaction. Yeah. And it’s custom for who you’re working with. Yeah. It’s not just a whole room full of people. Uh, okay. So looking at your profile, you know, we do have, how do you ever research, and I would say it looks like you’re a family man, right?
00:28:11 Yeah. So tell me about that. I got three kids. I’m pretty much all in college so they moved on, but uh, definitely growing the business with three kids. I uh, unfortunately, you know, divorce happens and uh, had the three kids all in sports. So I basically was a show for, I’m sure plenty of people know what that’s like. You just drive here, drive there, drive there, right? Um, but yeah, I just built a business and raise kids, didn’t do much dating at all for a long time. Just uh, just focused on them. But it was, it was great. My son played football and basketball and my two girls playing volleyball. I got to watch sports all the time.
00:28:53 So how did you balance work and family? Because that’s the struggle we all have in real estate. Right. And you are doing massive volume. You weren’t just joe blow wholesaler like you were in many people’s eyes. The guy in Phoenix. Well texting is, it’s
00:29:11 definitely helped, right? Because that’s, you can do it from anywhere. But uh, no, I just, I’d go into the office, I do my foreclosure stuff back, you know, I’m, and I’d show for my kids. I pick my kids up for, they went to a Christian school, so no bus system, um, every morning at 7:00 AM. Took them to northwest Christian. They both went down, went through northwest Christian and then, you know, did my foreclosure stuff and I was, drove my houses wholesale and then I was back by their neck of the woods at like 4:00 going to football practice or volleyball practice or basketball practice. And that’s, that was the program for a long, long time.
00:29:48 So it sounds like the mobile office on your phone. Yeah, he, yeah, but you don’t have to take many phone calls, you don’t have to.
00:29:56 Obviously most of us text way more than we take calls. Right. Um, but yeah, it’s few calls I texted all the time. Obviously, you know, the, the laptops or the IPADS obviously helped a lot too. Um, and that’s, you know, that lets me do real estate from anywhere. So that’s what’s awesome.
00:30:17 Okay. Um, and then I, I see lots of pictures of you and the water, right? I don’t know which boat is yours. Which one’s not yours, but I see lots of boats, so let’s talk about that.
00:30:28 So, uh, yeah, I’ve been boating for a long time. I’m a licensed captain. I’m also a licensed pilot, but uh, um, my boat is in the Bahamas. That’s awesome. Yeah. I need to vacation together. Yeah, anytime. I’m actually going to spend a, one of my bucket list items. I’m going to spend seven days on a boat in Greece. I’m opening from today. Oh, that’s awesome. Yeah. Cool. I’m going to do the islands of core few in the southern islands out there, but yeah, I tried to get on a boat sometime, like four to six weeks a year. Um, and I’m, I’m always available. He still texts me and still email me. I’ll answer. But uh, I mean that’s why I do real estate. Right, right. I’m not going to go buy an expensive car. For me it’s all about life experiences. It’s not about like tangible.
00:31:17 Thanks. So, so you said four to six weeks, so it means four times. Four to six times a year or 46 total weeks.
00:31:22 Four to six times a year. I try to get to. So I’ve been to the Bahamas three times this year. Um, I’ve been to key west. Um, I’m going to go to Greece. I got the Bvi set up for November was the BBA British Virgin Islands.
00:31:37 Ah, Gotcha. I’m not a well traveled person, so that’s cool. It’s good to know. Good to know. Friends have boats too, I think they say, but ownership’s not so great. But having friends with boats, that’s. Yeah, it’s awesome. Yeah, let me deal with it. Right. Okay. So we already talked about nurturing, so what are some crm tools or systems that you could not live without in your business?
00:31:57 So I, I’m a dinosaur, right. I’m still just using like eye contact to send out the email blast. I don’t. Yeah, I don’t even have a text blast. I don’t know. I’m actually working on setting it up. I, I’ll have one probably in the next 30 days, but literally finding deals and you know, is the network of agents that I deal with and literally texting the wholesalers over coffee two or three times a week. Yeah. And I literally just used the same phrase so I can search on my phone and just pull up the list and start texting him. That’s awesome. Uh, okay. Any interesting war stories? I’m interesting. War. Yeah. I mean, uh, there’s, I mean, which kind of, you’re looking for
00:32:49 a nightmare scenarios. I mean not like the trial level, but far worse.
00:32:55 I’m far worse. Uh, obviously a post-sale bk is no fun. Um, I did, uh, bought a house at Auction and so they, they were trying to save it, so they became after the house was paid for. So now you’ve got to get, now you got to get the state released on the bk just before you can start the eviction. Worst thing that can happen to you at a trustee sale. Um,
00:33:23 so they filed a bk to stop the foreclosure,
00:33:26 but they, but they artist the window, we missed the window and we’d already paid for it. Okay. So that doesn’t happen very often. I’m a hard money story. That’s, you know, granddaughter forged grandma signature on a hard money loan that we did, um, that took about. So house is sold to another wholesaler, you know, she’s evicting grandma. Grandma didn’t sell the house. Um, we lent the money on it, so now we’re tied up on.
00:33:55 Wow. Yeah. So she sold her grandmother’s house without talking to grandma.
00:34:02 So that was also. Should have covered that. Yeah. But it doesn’t cover the interest. Does it go with the interest? Right. So if you’re a hard money lender and you’re paying your buddy, one of your five to six guys that has money with you and you want his money back,
00:34:18 right, you pay him right course. Find a way to pay it. So, you know, I forgot to ask this earlier. So, uh, you get five or six guys, you know, the pooling their funds together. Did you create a sentence
00:34:29 occasion to make that happen? So all individual deeds of trust, all individually, these are trust. Yeah. So I do a credit facility, um, document which says, Hey, you’re going to lend me $2,000,000 and then I avoid, I assigned individual deeds of trust. Do approximately that number. I mean, I might actually have $2,050,000 assigned to you even though you only have $2,000,000 with me. Right? Um, but yeah, it’s all individual. Um, I could have done a syndication, but there’s been some bad syndications that have happened in this town.
00:35:03 Yeah. Yeah. I’ll just leave it at that. Yeah. A buddy of mine basically said that, yeah, you want to end up on American greed started syndication.
00:35:11 Yeah. So, um, I’ve uh, in the downturn, you know, it’s, you know, I’ve had some buddies lose a decent amount of money in syndications. I’ve had other people that I know loose money and syndications, and so this is a way for me to raise money and say, you don’t have to worry about that. I’m going to assign you an individual deeds of trust. If I get hit by a truck tomorrow, here’s your portfolio, here’s the spreadsheet. As soon as I get your, I assign them to you. Um, you know, I’m a licensed mortgage bankers, so that’s a difference. So just a little education as a licensed mortgage banker, you allowed to obviously take fees like you are a broker, but as a banker, you’re allowed to take a spread as a broker, you’re not allowed to take a spread. Oh, okay. Um, and then if you start and if you’re not licensed at all and you’re taking a spread, then you’re actually take, you’re basically taking a fraction of a note that isn’t your note. So it’s technically a securities violation. So jail time times what I’m hearing. So that’s just kind of the breakdown. So as being a banker, you’re allowed to take a spread and take fees and that’s why we’re a licensed mortgage banker.
00:36:18 So walk me through this because everyone sells syndication as a great resource. You know, you go to one of these real estate seminars and they’re like, oh, you gotta start, it’s an occasion, you just need 30. Okay to get started, blah, blah blah. But everyone I’ve talked to you in the real world, so this is a nightmare. Why is it so bad compared to what they sell you at the seminars? Well,
00:36:39 the 30 grand for this indication is just to get basically the lawyer’s fees done, right? Right. And now you gotta go raise the money. Typically they want you to have some of your own money in the, in the syndication, but then you gotta go, go raise it. And I mean, it’s way easier now than it used to be because of crowd funding. Right? Right. Um, and you can actually do, um, and I’m not a securities attorney at all. So, um, but you just got to go raise the money, right? Um, and you can actually do a little email blasts now saying, hey, I’m, I’m looking to raise money. That’s actually with the new crowdfunding laws allowed. It’s allowed. No. Yeah, that’s allowed. No. Wow. Okay. Before you actually had to have a relationship and stuff like that. So, um, it’s a little easier now, but you know, it’s not something that I’ve ever wanted to do just because it’s kind of my selling tool. Like you have your portfolio, it’s yours. If something goes bad with my company, something goes bad with me. Here it is, right? You don’t need an auditor to come down, break it up. Here’s your 20 loans, you know, you had $2,000,000 with me. Maybe it’s only one point nine, $8 million, but it’s, it’s all there. You own it. I assigned it to you. It’s more paperwork then obviously a guy with a pbm or a syndication, but I don’t know all the guys that give me money like it. So yeah.
00:38:07 And I think it’s cleaner if there’s ever a situation, like you said, anything happens to Chris. Chris gets hit by a bus, right? Paperwork’s there. You don’t need to receive her to come through. Nope. Break it all up. And then just so you guys know, the ones that are listening, I receivership or an eye receivership, a syndication is when a bunch of people who put money together to create a security is fine. A lot of you go to these real estate seminars, a lot of guys promote this, but you know, they’re also making money when they sell it. Generally the, the attorney, right, right. They want the 30 grand put it together for you. It sounds really sexy. Yeah. Uh, alright. So pace has a question. Um, what do you see as the future of wholesaling? Um, I mean you’ll see like in three years, five years, so things are gonna be the same way they are, they are today
00:38:50 be even more competitive. Right? I mean the younger kids are just getting better and smarter, right? Yeah. I’m a dinosaur, but I just, I just rely on the network and you know, I’m doing some things to change that. But um, you know, this is probably the most competitive market there is. I mean, if you look at, so when I go to a collective genius and look at the numbers from all the other big wholesalers throughout the country, I think the last time I did a letter, the response rate was a like point zero, zero one, five percent. I mean, every parent’s nutritious. Yeah. I mean not even a 10th of a percent or, and where, you know, a lot of guys in collective genius, there’s like, oh yeah, the yellow letters or two point two percent and two point eight percent. And I’m like, and to be in your market, right? Um, so it’s just going to be more and more competitive. It always seems like this is the breeding ground for every technology piece. I mean, look, you’ve got opendoor offer pad, you know, they just zillow, right? They just keep coming. Now you get to what’s the new $3,000 listing service that just came in from Utah? They just showed up like, and they’ve got billboards. It’s 1500 and 30,000. I was at 1500, I just saw their billboard. I don’t even remember their name, but yeah.
00:40:09 So, um, and I think the, I can’t remember, someone shared with me, it was a Sean Terry Webinar and he was going through his number, it’s like you were talking about is like, well, you know, we do 100 this or we can get 20 of this and blah blah blah, and we walked into the house and we offer them this and they beat us up to this and he was saying like, you know, we try to get to like eighty cents on a dollar and like the people on the, on, on the Webinar were like laughing and you could hear them laughing like, what do you mean eighty cents on a dollar? Right, right. Like we gave him like 55, sixty cents on a dollar. Yeah. But, you know, good thing about Sean,
00:40:45 you got a big enough network that he can sell that. Right, right. So, um, yeah, I mean he’s, I’m sure is networks bigger than mine. So, um, yeah, it’s just, it’s just market, right,
00:40:55 right. So it’s just crazy, crazy market, um, who pays more. But another great question, who do you look up to?
00:41:02 Who I look up to, um, you know, I, uh, I kinda had some guys, they looked up into this industry, but they’re, they’re all gone. I hate to say that I’m, I’m like the old guy, um, you know, actually look secretly like look at some of the younger guys and all the stuff they do and like, man, I need a guy to get on my game or I need to get out. Um, so um, all the technology that’s coming on board that, I mean I don’t even a text blast for my wholesale. I should be shot by now. Right. So, um, it’s funny that I’m actually sometimes looking up, not looking at younger kids are, you know, doing, doing my business better and uh, needing to go that I need to, I need to get better at it. I did close 21 house package in August, so luckily the reputation helps. But um,
00:41:57 so they can change the technology and I’m not saying that’s not, we’re not going to discount that. Obviously they can, you know, use different tools, whatever, but they still have their relationship in the room
00:42:05 mutation. Right, right. Yeah. So that’s where you get a huge lego. Yeah. And I, and I continued to, you know, I was at a networking event, you know, there was a vip networking event. I got an invitation, right. And I don’t ever turn down an invitation now. I think it was on a Monday, Tuesday night. I’m there. I am. And I, I actually, uh, you know, I ran into some old friends and I mean, I, I was there at five and I was still there at 10 or 10:30, you know, working through that because, you know, you run into people and you never know. You should see how many deals I make from the Phoenix Open because you run into people you haven’t seen in a year, really. You read, you reconnect with them and then they’re back on the text message like, Hey, what do you got? So, so I think in addition to building with, you need to hang out with you at the open as well. Got to go to the open.
00:42:59 All right. Uh, and then, uh, Gustavo placeres wants to know who, who do you look at as your mentor?
00:43:06 Um, no I don’t, I don’t know. Um, or are you in any coaching programs? You know, I, uh, I just belonged to collective genius. It’s weird because, you know, I’ve only been in collective genius for two or three years. There are a couple of monsters out there. Yeah. Brad Chandler, I don’t know if anybody knows who he is. He’s a monster. He’s a machine. Um, I kinda gave up like the, you know, the big dreams of, you know, having, you know, the big, the Ferrari or the Lamborghini or any of that stuff. That’s, that’s not me. I drive an f 1:50. I’m really. Yeah. I drive a truck and uh, you know, I just, you know, good family guys. I look up to people in the community, people that are given back, those are the guys I look up to because they’re working hard and they’re doing more for the community. Okay,
00:44:05 cool. Brad Pickett wants to know about your story, but you’re both thinking. Of course he does. Uh, and then, uh, pay says that he’s happy to show you how to do a text blast if you’ll take them to the Bahamas with you.
00:44:19 Um, so the boat story, um, um, I literally saw I had a boat in the Bahamas is a private boat. I’m cruising across. I needed to get some maintenance, was taking it to fort. I did about 80 miles on a Tuesday with another guy in the business as a Steve Peterson. Some of you guys may know, I may not know. Um, and we stopped at the west end and then we’re driving from the West End to our Fort Lauderdale or 21 miles off the coast of the Bahamas or cruise in it. Eight and a half knots. And I looked down, do an eight and a half nuts. Well my boat should do nine and a half knots and I’m just like, oh, something’s wrong. So I run downstairs.
00:45:07 It has a high water alarm. Next thing I know, but over the diesel’s you can’t hear it. So. And open up the engine, hatch it, knee high in water. Um, so I run upstairs, shut down the engine that’s taken on the water. Now no more water’s coming in. All three bilge pumps are running. Um, I went that Wednesday because it was supposed to be glass out there. I was supposed to go on Saturday, but it called for, you know, six to eight foot seas. Well, there was 30 knots a wind out of the east. Um, I’m on a boat that has a bunch of water in it and it’s not floating right. And 30 knots of wind and the ocean can create swells over time. Yeah. So from time of problem to getting picked up out of a dinghy by another fishing boat, coast guard, helicopter overtop was 42 minutes.
00:46:01 It’s not horrible. So needless to say, I, uh, got a trip back to the bottom as the guy picked us up, said, hey, we’re going back to the Bahamas. Not like someone picks you up in the middle of the ocean. You get a choice of where you’re going. Right. So, uh, he took us back to the Bahamas. I even forgot my flip flops. Everything went down with a boat. I’m in trunks and a tank top and no shoes and uh, found some size eight was best that I could find, whereas a size eight and flew back home insurance cover at all. Um, yeah, after about three depositions for me, I think a couple for Steve and about eight months or nine months I finally got, got my check. So I bet you’re not using the insurance company again. I just think they think that we went out into the middle of the ocean to get some insurance money.
00:46:54 Like really? Do you think I want to go out in the middle of the ocean and risk a bunch of lies for some insurance money. But yeah, just it was a painful or deal. But uh, I guess, you know, if you have a safety plan, at least it’s nice to know it works. Yeah. Uh, Brian’s apolis wants to know when you guys go and golf and again, um, let’s go golfing. I’m not very good as well. So Chris, yeah. Chris has anytime. So a paste wants to know besides wholesaling, what are your other longterm investment strategies? Obviously everybody does. Rentals. Are they a lot of people who jumped into reynolds? Right. I think, uh, obviously rentals probably don’t pencil in Phoenix as well as I do probably in other markets now. Right? Um, you know, my investments strategy has always been, you know, I’m taking a spread on hard money, you know, I’m paying, you know, like I said, I don’t, I don’t have cheap money. I’m paying in, you know, private guys, so they want 10. I’m lending at 12 or 14 and um, you know, making my spread there. So, um, you know, I’ve dabbled outside of um, real estate a little bit and I don’t seem to do as well, so I’ve just really kind of stayed focused on what I know.
00:48:08 Do you try the, you know, the Burger model, was it by repair Rehab, was it by Rehab refinance I camera, but you know, you buy cash out, is that might be another one or do you have, um, you know, a buy and hold like every three that I wholesale buy a property, any of those things
00:48:28 I don’t, I really just focused on the hard money and I’m, I’m a wholesaler. Heart, I don’t rehab anything if I, the only time I’m rehabbing and listing is cause I can’t wholesale it, you know, obviously like I said on my commitments to buy, you know, I told grandma and buying her house, I can’t leave grandma high and dry, so if I don’t wholesale it, I keep it in every now and then I’m like, you know, I’m trying to wholesale it and I don’t make as much as I would, but I’m even to the point like if it’s a two or three grand loss, I’ll wholesale it. I’ll just move it. Just be done with it. Yeah. That’s my. And you know, even that one I had lost 10 or 11 grand on a. just move it. Yeah. So I’m, I’m a wholesale, but every now and then I’m like, ah, do I lose seven on this one? No, I saw, obviously I bought it for that price. So I saw the vision there that maybe everybody else can’t see. So I’d give it a shot.
00:49:23 Um, and then do you use any of your own capital when Elaine, are you always use?
00:49:29 No, some of it’s mine, but, uh, mostly it’s other people’s, my, my current money is in building spec homes in Paradise Valley. Um, but I got to go and currently, and that’ll probably be my last two just because white being a two point $1,000,000 house when there’s a little uncertainty. Right.
00:49:54 So we’ll talk about that. A little uncertainty. What, what uncertainty are you sending, sensing?
00:49:58 Um, well, you’ve seen a, obviously there’s been some articles about some of the super hot market, Seattle, Portland, California. I’ll take in all slowing down. I think if any wholesaler didn’t say they saw a blip in June and July, they’d be not telling you the truth because definitely. I mean, maybe they didn’t see it as much as I did, but it was tough to wholesale a house in June, July. Now August has been better. Um, you know, the start of September it has been better. Um, and then you talk to, you know, I always go to people that understand the business. So I just called title companies, right, right. Oh, they see it, they know it. So I called a couple title officers and uh, they’re like in June and July I closed 90 percent of my book. That was their response and I’m, and I’m not entitled, so I didn’t know what that meant, but, uh, I’m like, explain that to me.
00:50:54 Well, that means they closed, you know, the June and July escrows. They didn’t have any opens so they didn’t have any of their pipeline coming back in. So that was kind of telling. I’ve reached back out to them since and things seemed back to normal. But, uh, obviously it’s a cycle. Sooner or later it changes. Um, you know, stock markets had a 10, 11 year run, right? Real estate’s going on a 10 year run. Um, you know, it’s nice about Arizona market now is everybody has equity, right? The last time nobody had equity go to b of a and hey, I want 105 percent on my house sign right here with your three day, right of rescission and you’ve got a high, 100, five percent of your house, um, with not a lot of people given seconds. Everybody has equity. So, but if you, if the market slows because of uncertainty, alls it takes is a $300,000 house and having a comp. But you have a guy that bought in 2010 for 150 on that $300,000 house and he wants to drop the to 70 because he wants to move only handful of those politics. Yeah.
00:52:12 Um, okay. So what was going to ask thing it. Oh, you, you were mentioning that a lot of wholesale has noticed a blip. It was harder to wholesale in June or July. When you say it was harder, was it harder to acquire a harder to move?
00:52:27 There was just nobody buying are not as many people buying. Definitely. So, you know, I uh, but is that, is that a bad sign? I look at that as a good sign. No. Yeah, it’s, it was, you know, you don’t have as many motivated homeowners. Yeah. Well I was, you know, trying to keep 20 a month. You got to keep buying. Right. So we’ll sell against that. But for a market. Yeah. So I had bought, I had my schedule and I thought I was gonna have a great June and you know, I’ve committed to buy some. I think I definitely from one guy that I buy from my last $21,000 just because I’ve committed to buy and I sold them and they’re just, the buyers were gone, but I’ve committed to pay for it so you know. No, but I mean, you know, the real estate market as a whole is great.
00:53:15 I mean I think last time I checked there 16,000 active listings and that’s active, that’s mobile third everything, right? Nevertheless I’m an even not a buyers market amount of seller’s markets, like $32,000. So you’re half inventory of like a flat market. So I’m builders, you know, used to pump out 60,000 permits a year. I think there they’re like 20, 21, something like that right now. So obviously, you know, our market is very healthy. I’m just, you know, obviously uncertainty and there’s always the herd mentality, right? People kind of start going that way. The masses follow
00:53:54 well sort of that self fulfilling prophecy right? If everyone says the sky is falling, the sky’s going to fall. Right? Right. And are at least in our business. Uh, so then paste wants to know if you got guys lending to you at 10, is that 10 all the time? Only time.
00:54:06 It depends on what they sign up for. Some people like to keep their cash, you know, maybe it’s a guy. I got one guy, a couple of guys that are apartment guys, right. And they don’t want to commit. If I, if you, if it’s 10 all the time I make you say I want a year, 18 month, two year commitment. If you just want to be liquid then it’s kind of as you have money type of deal. So I got a couple of guys that are apartment guys and they don’t know when their next opportunity is to grab an apartment and you know, they do apartments in other states too, so they’ve put money in and then as it pays off they just kinda balanced or sheet. Whereas other guys are like, here, I want you to take this $5 million and just keep it both the. Send me the check and tell me if there’s a problem. Okay, nice.
00:54:51 Uh, so Ernie paths wants to know, have you had
00:54:54 any partnerships go south? Um, you know, I’ve only been into partnerships in my 18, 19 years, you know, and uh, I mean that one broke up because of the, you know, to sell 2007 downturn. We were actually under contract for $44, million dollars to sell our company. Um, and next thing you know, downturn happens. Citibank who’s buying US cancels. Um, and when there’s no money left, it’s not hard to say, oh, we’ve been in business for five or six years, do I still like, you know, we just saw, just went our own ways. It was nothing. I mean there’s just like, hey, let’s go try something new. So, you know, my partners are now family and he can’t break up a family. All right. So yeah, and another partnership, that’s, that’s the only two. That one was, that one was done in the downturn. And then, you know, I’ve been, I’ve been partners with Kim and Tim, my family since then. Okay. Um,
00:55:59 and I see, so hey, you know, we, we’re, we’re betting on this earlier and I noticed that you’re really good looking at a comment. Greg wants to know why you’re so handsome because that same bold head is he has, uh, let’s see. Anything else? Uh, so gus wants to be a nationwide are local. We already talked about your local. Yeah, I’m just a local guy. All right. So, uh, what is your biggest struggle right now?
00:56:22 Obviously everybody’s biggest struggles finding deals, right? Um, so, you know, that’s why you said the Guy Krystle texts me every week or every other week. Yeah. He’s like, it’s like clockwork. So I, uh, you know, just keep going after it just like everybody else does. Um, I don’t have the technology that some of the younger guys do, but I just use the network and I keep and I keep trying to expand the network. So.
00:56:50 Okay. Uh, and what is your superpower? Superpower? I do like all the marvel movies though. They’re pretty good. Yeah. Yeah. I enjoy all of them too. And then we’ve got the DC ones. They’re not quiet. Same Level. Uh, what lesson would you want to teach today’s young real estate entrepreneurs?
00:57:08 Um, you know, it’s just Kinda, you just can’t give up. Like, I mean, it can’t be easy in this market being as competitive it is, but I don’t know. You just can’t give up. You can’t, can’t stop trying. I mean, I think I attended my first trustee sale. I’m in late September or maybe early October. I bought my first trustee sale in December. That means I went down there every single day for three months. And didn’t buy a house. You’re bidding? Yeah, but I didn’t buy a house. First House I bought was one, one six, one one north thunderbird road. I still know the address. Sun City about an age restricted property.
00:57:52 Your Dad on tidal? What’d you do about that?
00:57:53 No, I just, I borrowed hard money at 18 percent. Paid a thousand dollar fee. I know. Yeah. I started this business with a home equity line of credit of 60 hand. Wow. No money. Just a home equity line of credit. So
00:58:05 where did you feel like you experienced the good old boys network starting in 1999. Oh yeah.
00:58:11 So when we did it was a good old boy network for sure. You should have seen, I mean the games people play back then.
00:58:17 Yeah. So talk about that because we’ve always heard about the good old boys network, but I never got to experiencing. So what, what, what was, what was that like?
00:58:25 I was, there were a couple of guys that control this entire market and you know, back then to buy a house at trustee sale was a thousand dollars cash and we’re all walking around with, you know, $70,000 in our pocket. But um, you know, guys that are buying 10 to 15 houses a day to lose a thousand, 2000 bucks cash to keep a guy like me out of it. That’s nothing because they’re going to wholesale 10 to $15,000 are 10 to 15 houses that, you know, three to four grand. Um, yeah. So they would bid up and then that by just to keep you out of it. So here’s, so you new at the trustee sale, right, and there’s three or four of them at the trustee sale. I still think there are three or four of them because they didn’t trust each other, but that’s just my own thing. But there’s three or four of them at the trustee sale and house opens at 100 grand, right? Yeah. Someone bids 100, 1000, then you bid 100,000, then someone else jumps in and bid zero to 150,000. He doesn’t pay a thousand bucks. You’re at 1:49 nine. It’s your first sale. You’re anxious. You look at it, trust. He calls you back and says you want the house? You’re like, got a little aggressive there. That’s my first time. You know, you don’t buy it. You think it’s it?
00:59:46 The guy that bid 100,000 or 100 bucks. Oh, it goes back to them for 49,000 hours less. Oh, pretty good game. Yeah. I mean when it’s only a thousand dollars cash, you can play all kinds of games, especially if you know, there was definitely some stuff. I mean,
01:00:04 well, I knew they beat each other up or bid. You have to keep you out. Yeah, it was, I didn’t, I didn’t. I didn’t really understand that dynamic. And so it’s very interesting like a history lesson, right? Yeah. And I, I’ve, I’ve talked to a couple of guys saying, you know, hey, I’m thinking of expanding down to Tucson and say good luck down there. There’s good old boys network down there. It’s like, I don’t even know what that means. Surprise still exists, but.
01:00:23 Well obviously, um, you know, you got guys that go to the auction every day and you’re new and they make deals. Um, or they’re, they, they’re making deals frequently, you know, obviously that’s why the 10,000 are big check came in to keep it out. The reason what it was. Yeah. To keep that little. Oh, I can, I mean, you can lose a thousand dollars. No big deal. You lose $10,000 a bigger deal, right? Yeah. So, um, you got guys buying 10 to 15 houses a day. They’re not worried about a thousand dollars to keep you out of the auction. Right.
01:00:57 Okay. And what is the greatest lesson you’ve learned in your real estate career?
01:01:04 I’m probably never sign a personal guarantee. Yeah, I mean, got it. You know, not the first person on the show to say that. Yeah. So obviously I didn’t have a personal guarantee, you know, and I didn’t have a personal guarantee with some of the friends and family, but friends, friends and family. Right. That’s a guarantee. Yeah. So
01:01:24 yeah. Okay. Uh, what was your favorite best or most interesting failure?
01:01:31 Um, pro. I mean, obviously when you lose four and a half million bucks or you know, that’s, I mean, that’s the worst one you can have. I mean, nothing, nothing has happened that bad since then. You know, I’ve probably lost, I’ll ask. My biggest loss is $26,000 to date since the 2007. Um, and that was a, a fraud based house. So, I mean, I couldn’t do anything about that. No you can’t. That’s the granddaughter one. Yeah. Crazy. So,
01:02:08 uh, is there a book that you’ve given more than any other?
01:02:12 Um, this is one of those questions is really bad for me. I am. So I was successful, um, because I’m a numbers guy. Yeah. I’m, I was, I graduated with Grand Canyon with a double major in math, computer science. Okay. Um, it took me three times to pass my English entrance exam in the Grand Canyon. Give you an idea how much I read. Right. So I’m a numbers guy. I’m a math guy. I do not read books.
01:02:39 Okay, that’s fair enough. So, um, and is there anything that keeps you up at night? Yeah, I mean,
01:02:45 um, no, obviously we all have our stresses when things go bad, it can be the simplest one that just like I’m thinking about, it might be a house that I’m trying to wholesale and um, I thought we thought it was a home run. So I, I committed to it and it’s not selling. I don’t like no one likes mistakes. Right, right. So the smallest mistake, even if it’s only like, you know, a $10,000 loss, it’s still just, it’s bins, you know, I’m like, oh, I got to face my partners on this one and I don’t. Obviously no one likes to be not successful. Yeah. Well, $10,000 mistake is still a pretty serious mistake. I mean, but if you’re doing 20 houses a month, you know, it’s, I mean, it’s,
01:03:34 it washes out the law of averages. Um, okay. So maximum is wants to know what keeps you going on the wholesaling side?
01:03:43 No, what else am I going to do? I can spend four to six weeks a year on a boat and probably my biggest complaint from all my friends is I’m always on my phone, texting, you know, like Chris be be here when I’m working. I don’t know when the next text is going to come across. It’s going to make me five to seven grand. So, but, uh, three kids in college, you know, that’s not cheap. No, no. So, uh, obviously in, in the college doesn’t stop. You should the tech, the text blast come in, Hey dad, can you move to a hundred bucks a day? I can give you 300 bucks a day, you know,
01:04:22 well I got three kids, they’re going to be going to college. So how much do I need to wholesale a month to be able to afford that?
01:04:29 Well, I’ve been, uh, I’m currently, I don’t know, somewhere about, I think you have a 12 grand for tuition a year. I think Asu is 11. Um, the third is just entering junior college, so that’s a little cheaper, but I mean I had, they all went to northwest Christian so I’ve been used to this
01:04:49 for a long time, so just got to keep performing. Yeah, just gotTa keep going. Very cool. Uh, let’s see. Paste wants to know if you had a time machine, what saved your life would you go back to and what will you tell that version of himself? Go back to. Oh, seven and liquidate. Liquidate. Yup. That’s it on the rest of my life. Well, I think that’s a good place to end it. So if someone wants to get ahold of you, what’s the best way for them to get ahold of you? Either email or text message. Do you want to put your air now? It’s your cell phone here. Yeah, it’s six. Oh, two, two, nine, two, eight. One six. Awesome. And again, guys, if you liked the show, please share this episode right now and then tomorrow night we’ve got our monthly meetup, Genova, Dallas is going to be presenting our. We’re going to be at mcfate brewing from 4:30 to 6:30 tomorrow night, so please be sure to attend. We’ve love to meet you. Thank you, Chris. Thank you. Appreciate it. That was awesome.
What started the #realestatedisruptors movement? Steve also talks about his wholesale business.
To watch the whole interview, go to www.realestatedisruptors.com/video/interview-with-steve-trang/
Steve Trang shares what started the Real Estate Disruptors movement, and what is going on in his world in regards to wholesaling.
Video Replay of Interview with Steve Trang
Podcast Replay of Interview with Steve Trang
00:00 Hey everybody, welcome for today’s special episode of real estate disruptors. Today we’re doing a little bit differently. We get Chris Mayfield interviewing me. He thought it’d be a good idea. We did a little poll and apparently that’s what people want. So that’s what we’re doing today. Um, and then if this your first time tuning in, I’m Steve Trang, broker, owner of Stunning Homes Realty, cofounder of the offer fast app, the one app you need for wholesaling. And my goal is to help people become real estate entrepreneurs. I had some struggles when I first started. You’ve hoped a lot of people build their businesses and our goal for this show is to help people become real estate leaders faster. Um, and if you’re excited for the show, please give us some thumbs up some ways. And this is a live episode. Chris is going to be checking out the question, so please don’t hesitate to answer.
00:46 And with that, yeah, here we go. Good to go. Yep. So I sat down with you a few months ago and uh, your gracious to give me my time, which I always respect when an investor who was willing to do that. And I asked you about wholesaling, but I thought first it would be cool to share about your journey that you shared with me. You went from an electrical engineer to all of this, right? Can you tell us a little bit about how you went from that to here? So, uh, I was an engineer by default and that sounds kind of ridiculous, but you know, when I went through high school and college I was pretty good at math and being good at math, you know, it’s really what you need science and math to be good at engineering. And so for me, when I was trying to figure out what major I wanted to do, engineering was the, was the easy option.
01:37 So I did that and I can’t say I was ever really passionate about engineering. I know they are really a handful of people that really are, but generally speaking, people aren’t really excited about engineering. So. And that was me and I know that when I was working at Intel, um, I didn’t really fit in as an engineer, um, for an engineer. I was extroverted. Now naturally my persona is introvert, but amongst engineers I was an extrovert. I just didn’t fit in. Um, which is ironic because now that I’m in sales, I’m the opposite now I’m now I’m an introvert again and everyone else’s the extrovert. So, so then how do you go from electrical engineer to real estate agent to broker to overall well rounded investor. So the passion sometimes seep through or lack of passion, uh, they were, I would typically work 25, 30 hours a week.
02:33 And that was what was, I wouldn’t say it was normal. A lot of people were working 40, 50, 60 hours a week. And, and if you’re working intel, it was known for being a sweatshop, right? Uh, but I’ve had, I had incredible mentors along the way. So as long as I got my work done, it was acceptable. So I’d roll in 9:30 and I was out by five and sometimes 4:30 4:00 on Mondays. Because you want to be on the good Games at lifetime fitness, you’ve got to be on the gym by four. And I thought, you know, no one noticed, but one of these days I was actually there after five and the manager was like, Oh, you’re still here. But that just goes to show, you know, like I had great managers and that they, they liked the quality of work I did. So they didn’t give me grief for not, you know, working 40, 50, 60 hours.
03:17 Uh, but going back to the, the passion, just because I was good at it, didn’t mean I was excited about it. So I always knew that I was going to quit after seven years. Um, that was the plan. I was gonna start a business. I didn’t know what business, but I know I’m gonna start a business after seven years. What was the significance of seven years? That’s when all your stocks vests the golden handcuffs. So after seven years, this show’s brought to you by Intel. So all, all, all your stocks, vests and you get a, um, a as a, it’s a two month sabbatical. So you get two months vacation, right? So I figured that’d be a good time to go explore my options, but along the way, uh, my friends and I have three friends that we bought investment properties together with and when we’re buying investment properties, we met my first broker and I was talking to him and I said, hey, what you seem to do is very interesting and you make how much money really I can do that.
04:09 Wait, what do you do? I just talk to people. I can do that. So I went from there, meeting him and asked him, Hey, if I want to learn everything you do, what would be involved so you can just go get your real estate license. So from that dinner to two and a half weeks later, I was licensed, right. Sign up for real estate school, got licensed who half weeks? As soon as I was licensed, I mean in my two weeks notice at Intel and that was in both feet. Real estate, may of 2007. Not a good time, but I’ll hold it all in. Then you go from agent to broker. What was that? I mean, was that the goal? Uh, no. The goal, and I tell everyone, don’t be a broker, was not a good decision, but I did it. And the reason why I did it was as where I learn, I learned a lot, uh, the old broker, he was an incredible salesperson.
04:54 I’m still appreciative of the effort and attention he gave to me. I’m still think he hates me, but that’s a story for another day. But after three years I felt like I learned everything I could learn from him. And you know, this, the leadership has to do part of being a leader is staying ahead so you can lead the pack. And there came a time where I just felt like I was no longer following and I was leading and for me, I just couldn’t. I can’t follow someone that’s not ahead of me. So I decided, you know what? I’m going to go do my own thing. I’m learning all these things on my own. I’m investing in myself more than he was investing in himself. So at that point I said, I’m just gonna do my own thing. My own ways, and there was a little bit of a, of greed, right?
05:44 I figured if I didn’t have a broker then I won’t have to pay split. Um, and then I was doing a lot of interesting marketing and a lot of quick practice stuff and I didn’t want to get broker approval anymore. So between those two things, I thought I would start a brokerage, but then I that you’re much better off paying a split then paying a lease and the managing broker. Um, but fortunately along the way I found my passion, uh, so even though I got into real estate just to make more money, whatever, I found that what fulfills me the most is leading and developing people around me. Right? Side note on that, on the, on the leading and always having a leader out front. You also don’t want to get too far out. I’ve learned a lot in my past that I can go to the next thing before I’ve brought my town.
06:29 Right. And, and what happens is if you get too far ahead, you become hazy. Yeah. And they can’t tell if you’re the enemy or that you’re still their leader. Interesting. So you have to lead just far enough that you stay ahead and keep them hungry, but not too far away that you walk away from your team. Now. That makes sense. Yeah. So, so then the story to wholesale and how do you get to there. So when we’re talking about creative market, getting a, there was this thing that’s called a house buyer network back in the day and a lot of paper click marketing for finding motivated sellers. I was part of the Craig practice systems and I try to sign up for bills locked out and actually talked to the owner of the house by our network program who eventually became the owner of Commissions Inc. Made a lot of money selling that to fidelity to title.
07:06 But at that tiMe he said, you know, steve, I have a agreement with one agent in town and I can’t violate that agreement as a, hey, no problem. Dwayne, let me do it my own way. So I created my own paper click website. They my own thing to find sellers and I was able to, that sourced my business for quite some time and what we were doing was the guaranteed sale program. And so our guarantee sale program and say, chris, if I can’t sell your house, I’ll buy it myself now. I don’t buy it 100 percent right, but I’ll buy at 90 percent, right? Uh, so I go to these homeowners said, okay, here’s how the guarantee sale program works, going for these cash appointments and we offer them 80 percent. They said, well, we want cash today. So, well it’s 83 percent, you understand right?
07:47 After 90 days, this is what we want to cache. It’s like if you want cash today, we can buy at 80 because I thought no one would take that right boy, we were wrong. So the first time I say, hey chris, so you understand that if we list it right, you’ll get this, But if I buy it today, you get this. Instead you’re saying we’re talking like $10,000 here, no big deal. So the first few times we bought a house for 80 percent, we realized, boy, we’re doing this wrong. So we back that number up, but I just fell into wholesale and accidentally because I was trying to find motivated sellers to get more listings. Yeah, a little shout out here to andrew. What’s up andrew? Andrew lebaron saying what’s up? What’s up? Manager. Steve is usually looking at the computer, but today I am the interviewer.
08:28 So tell us a little bit about the struggle. Right? I think a lot of times we hear success stories, but I think people want to hear the infancy, right? What waS it like to, to grind and try to get this whole selling thing going? Well, uh, I will say there’s a lot of struggles all the time, waste the route and I would say there’s still struggles today. Uh, but I remember some of the stuff in the beginning for just traditional real estate. When I started in [inaudible] seven and through eight or nine, there not a lot of good opportunIties and we were happy to sell $30,000 condos. And I still remember installing a mailbox on a $30,000 condo so that we can close to talking about $900 bucks, you know, that’s less the commission I made on that one, which I paid a 50 slash 54 on the brokers, like 450 bucks.
09:17 The struggles that you had to face back then I felt sharpened me to be where I am today. Like there was a lot of pain along the way, but because of all the pain, all the struggles, I appreciate more than what we have. Um, and I think the, the, a lot of the people that are trying to be successful today, the, we’re in such a good time right now. The unfortunate thing is they don’t have any pain or struggle or they do, but not the same amount of pain and struggle that everyone that had to hustle and cut their teeth on back then. Right, right. So where you’re at today, obviously you’re, you’re, you’re moving, I really sense a lot of momentum with you and your team. What would you do differently if you, you know, I, I’ve learned in this business, if you can’t pivot you will you go down quickly.
10:05 So what would you do differently in the process of getting from here to there? I would focus more on the wholesaling sooner. Um, the, it’s, it’s a lot less or it tends to be a lot more transactIonal. Uh, I wish it weren’t that way, but that’s what I found to be the most successful part of our business. Uh, and it’s funny the, if you look at, and I was actually talking to brent daniels about this other day, we have homeowners like, you know, I list your house, chris, and let’s just say clemente rancher, that’s where I live and we set the record, you know, the highest in that neighborhood has been to 50 a square foot and I saw your house or to 80 a square foot. At the end of the day, you’re still dissatisfied. Like I either I didn’t get the binzer right or I didn’t get you up on the appraisal or this or that.
10:57 And we tried to do everything perfectly, but we’re still humans, right? Or the the, the lender took too long. What a titled in schedule, the signing, right? But there is always something that can go wrong and I can make you an extra 30 k and you’ll be disappointed. But on the flip side, as a seller, it’s using tHat buyers, buyers love you if you do a good job for buyers, they love you, but it motivated homeowner where you’re buying their home for 75 percent of market value is so grateful because they help you. And so as much, again going back to that fulfillment and doing a good job for people and being happy, like it’s so much more fulfilling to help someone go through that situation. Because we were on a walk this morning anD she said, I feel like the reason why you do well is because you approach it is a, is a help process.
11:43 They’re in a difficult situation. They’ve, they’ve, they’ve run the gamut on what they could do. Traditionally you’re just looking for a way out with the, with the least amount of pain. And we come in and try to offer something and honor them through the whole, through the whole process. So, so people that are out there looking, they’re in electrical engineering or thinking about jumping ship and they hear about real estate. I mean, you get on facebook, you get online, people are constantly selling systems and programs. where would you tell people to go look? Where do I go find a mentor? So fortunately we have shows like this and it was not this one, you know, we got some other ones that you can find an itunes store. Um, uh, there’S some great free content out there or go Into youtube. Uh, and then we have our meetup.
12:27 We do every first thursday of every month where we have a guest speaker speak that it’s supported and sponsored by us in the real estate disruptor is a movement. Um, but if none of those worked, then there’s also the facebook groups. Now you do have to sift through, you know, who’s real, who’s not real pay attention, do your due diligence, but just like you’ve done. And just like I do still today is I go and meet people that are moving, making things happen, and learning from them. I can say the parallel for me in traditional real estate before I open my own brokerage, before I got into coaching with craig proctor, I met with the calloways. I met with Russell Shaw and I reached out to a bunch of other people too that didn’t return my calls sometimes. That’s the way it is. He hits that way a lot.
13:11 Yeah. But the most successful people are happy to meet with you. They’re givers. Right? Um, so, uh, that’s what I would do is I would seek out other people that are doing well and asking them how I can add value to you. Right? Right. And I think someone made the example is like, if I need to go take your car to get washed, that’s what it takes to get time with you. I will take your car to get washed. Right? I mean, if I can learn from someone who’s making a hundred, 300, 500,000 a year, I will wash the car. If that’s not where I’m at today, I confess, I came out of another profession that was highly successful and when I first started doing this, I had one guy who came out of my same profession and just built into me and said, there’s plenty of stuff you can find without having to pay, but this last year I really have tried my best, so vulnerable and get out here and meet people.
13:56 I Think there’s a competitiveness slash a pride issue and wanting to go talk to someone, you know, and I just said, look, this is where I want to go. This is where they’re at. And meet them. The ones that will give me the time of day just to ask questions. And it’s tough because they think you’re there for an agenda. And I’m like, no, I just want to learn whenever you’ll share with me, you know, I’ll learn. And uh, it was funny, there was a guy that came into their office yesterday who wants to get his wholesale business going and he kind of jokes, yeah, we’re going to be a competitor. I was like, no, we’re not like, you’re going to find opportunities. You don’t know what to do with that. We can help you or someone is not something that’s ideal for us. It’s probably gonna be a deal for you.
14:31 I mean, I’m proud to, you know, for the people that have been guests on the show to call them friends and these guys have been givers, not takers. Right, right. These are guys are generally available and happy to help. That’s cool. So on that, you know, that realm of help, what are some steps, if you were to give somebody a newbie, five steps on how to get started, what, what would you do? You know, it doesn’t have to be five, but one, two, three. Like here’s what I would do to start this process. So the first thing I would do is find a mentor, find someone to copy someone’s got systems in place and ask them questions. Uh, the other things I would do is there’s three real quick on the mentor. How would you do that? You don’t want to pay them because you don’t have any money, but you do want to learn from them.
15:13 So how would you tell that person? I come to you and say, steve, I really want to learn from you. I, from your standpoint, I really bring nothing but I’m coming. I want help. What? How can I offer myself so that you would take the time, which is valuable to invest in me? So if I know that you want to learn this business and you’re committed and serious, but learning this business, then I will teach you how to do this business with our systems existing today. Right? We would give you the people that call, we will give you the script of the training, right? That’s one way to do it for someone that doesn’t have an ego and is okay, you know, learning that I was given this lesson a long, long time ago from one of the guys used to live poker with and he sold a window cleaning business for lots and lots of money, uh, back in Singapore.
15:59 And he started as a cleaner. He started day one, cleaning the windows work so you have to manage it, worked his way up, worked his way up, eventually wasn’t in position to buy the company, built it some more and then sold the company. It’s awesome. Right? So I think that one of the best ways to learn is to put knee deep in it and you know, you can look as an internship, you can look as an opportunity like as a job, but whatever you’re in a position to work the system with leads given to you and coaching and mentoring from. I did that over a year ago. I stopped what I was doing and I went and worked for someone else and I just said I need to know more than you need to be putting more fires because that’s my education, right. Deal. I’ve done. I’ve been educated.
16:47 Right. I mean the last. There was a deal I did recently and the gentleman was living in the house and his parents had died, but her mom was less than a year had died, had been removed. And so I’m trying to figure out how to do this. And I called my title company, which god bless them, they said, hey, just run over to the courthouse and ask a few questions. And I did. Yeah. And I got the deal and, but yet everybody else told me, no, you’re going to have to let it go. Let it sit. Probate as like, I’m not letting this sit, we’re going to figure out a way to do it. And I had chased six other family members down and we got, we got the job done right? and we hope the guy right in a difficult position. And I love that part.
17:21 It is. They have a smile on their face and say, thank you so much for helping. Then I know, hey, I’ve done the job I was supposed to do. So along those lines, what are you passionate about in this business? A, be passionate about every little step, but what are the parts in this process that really get you the most excited? So there’s two things I get excited about. One is doing good work is having people say thank you, you changed my life, right? Like, that’s always awesome. uh, so whether that’s sellers that we’ve saved buyers and traditional sellers that we’ve helped or the agents in my office, I’m like, these are all people that I love having that ability to support the other part, and this is the nerdy part, it was just building new systems, uh, at the colby test a few weeks, a couple of months ago, and that my rating is quickstart, meaning I just love making things.
18:12 I just don’t love finishing them. Hey, we just sAid that to me. Awesome. With starting, not so much putting the finishing touches on. Yeah. Yeah. So those are the things that I’m passionate. My mantra is keep going in your business today if we looked at your organization, uh, and we’re talking just about wholesaling right here. Yeah. What does that look like? uh, so right now is maximize self. That’s the partners. um, and then we got, um, we got ruben, george, ben, daniel, and these guys are affiliates. They’re either door knocking or cold calling. Um, and then we have other people that send us deals. People are saying, hey, I’ve got this tight up. Are you a buyer? Yes, I mean for the numbers, for the ones when they call you, it tends to be a yes, right? The ones where you’re getting email is, it’s like where’d that number Come from?
19:04 But when they call you, typically it’s, it’s a yes. So now how have you structured that with these guys, right? How do they come in and how do they perform and how do they get paId? Well, they get paid on the assignment, so when they bring me a number, so, um, I’ll give you a perfect example. Um, we didn’t go down this road, but I don’t care how much you make on the deal. If you made fifty thousand one hundred thousand dollars deal, good for you, right? You’re able to hustle, get that deal done. For me, our goal Is to make 10 to 20, maybe 30 on the deal, right? So I make that very clear to people that are sending us opportunities. I am not interested or it’s not a concern to me how much you make. What’s a concern to me is that there’s an opportunity available for me and I can make money on this deal.
19:50 That’s it, right? So when I tell people, call me first. Yeah, it’s for me, it’s not about how big the check is for me, what I do in memphis and other places. It’s about volume. yeah, I’ll take less. I’m trying to create a system where we’re doing more volume as opposed to gouging somebody on one deal than I ever get to work with them ever again. Well, it’s, it’s funny, right? Like you see these other guys. I’ve had friends I won’t mention their names, talk about they’re upset that the person they moved it to beat him up on the assignment fee is like, hey, you know what, it’s kind of tight. I can’t. This is too much for me. And then you find out they took all the margin that they beat you up on so you know it’s too much for you to make 10, but then they make 30 so they’d beat you down from 10 to three and now they started making 30 am eight, 37.
20:39 Right. That’s such a shortsighted way to do business. It really is. My first deal, my first deal I made I a 10 and not mentioning names, someone said, hey man, you don’t have any buyers. We’ll just put a little bit on top of it and they put another 10 what sat there because I knew it wasn’t a good deal at that price. So I said, man, thanks so much. I appreciate it. I’m just going to go do this on my own. I’m totally green but I’ll figure out a way so that the next day guess if you bring me this kind of deal about every time. So yeah, I get that. So how many acquisitions did you save? It was at five. Uh, so we got four guys working for guys. but what would they. TheIr, their associates. So it was max your acquisitions or is maximally.
21:20 Overall I’m overlooking the operation. He’s the one who’s going to the appointments. He’s not a, he’s not setting appointments. We have one person in Mexico booking the appointments. Got you. Now if they’re booking appointments, then what are these people doing? They’re just calling. They’re also calling. Okay. So we’ve got, they can book appointments as well. Yeah. Okay, so what would the person in Mexico be doing different than what your colors are doing as far as booking appointments? Uh, I will say they’re doing a little more scrubbing. Okay. Right. So the leads that come in, we’re going to have a lot of bad numbers, just the way it goes. Yep. So they get to do more of those numbers. Gotcha. Whereas our guys are going to have either prescreened or higher quality, just hotter leads. So are you and max both doing dispositions as far as selling deal or how’s that working?
22:04 Uh, we’re both, we’re both involved in it. Um, I would say max is in charge of makIng sure mco is constantly running. Um, we’re both doing acquisitions were both networking and dispelling right now I wouldn’t say we really have a strong guestbook because they’re requiring more than we’re wholesaling. Sure. At this exact moment. Okay, that’s cool. Any interest? Uh, any, uh, uh, war stories and he, you know, I think people learn from failure. Yeah. I think when they, when they see people are willing to be vulnerable and say, hey man, this, this man, this tore me up. Yeah, have any of that, uh, I don’t have any interesting war stories where we were impacted, but I do have a story that I thought was just the strangest thing and that this is a property require that foreclosure. And so we met the guy, so we’re door knocking, ben door knocked, met the home owner and say, hey, we saw your fur coat, your house go into foreclosure and next month we’re willing to pay x amount.
23:00 I think we offered on one, I think we started at 1:35, 1:40, we ended up at 1:50, which is what has payoff was right. Uh, or yeah, what his path was. And he kept dilly dallying, dilly dallying, shopping it. And it was funny, like he reached out to another wholesaler who then reached out to max. Like, hey, I’ve got this deal at one 60, one 65 max, I get out of here. We’re looking at that one, you know? Uh, and so the guy came back and said, hey, 1:55 is yours, was said at 1:55 a pile of the closing costs. We’re good to go. Shopped at some more, right. He went back to the other people and said what? What we were willing to pay. Yeah, he was, he was working, he was working. It took too long, got foreclosed on and we bought it at the courthouse. That’s what, 1:35. So it was just an interesting situation, but this is also reminding you can’t help everybody. Right? You can do your best. You can convey the information, you can present opportunities, but they still have
23:59 the walk through that door. Yeah. I was on the phone with the, with the lady, a sweet older lady and uh, she wasn’t living at the house and was kind of shopping it and I kind of gave her an offer on what I felt like I would normally do in my business. And she said, oh, you’re at least $20,000 short. And I said, I just stopped. I said, look, this is how this business works. I said, if that person is willing to pay you $20,000 more than what I’m offering, I said, can I tell you something? Take the money and run. She was, well, I think I might be able to get more. I said, no, that is the offer that it’s almost full market. Take it and run with the work that you said that’s needed in that place. and I just, you know what I did, I stopped and I took 15 minutes of my time and I said if those people can really pay $100, ask them to do it in the next three to four days.
24:44 Right. If they want their shopping your deal, you know, I just wanted her to be educated. I wondered, are undernourished because for me, if I, if I don’t lie and deceive, I don’t have to look over my shoulder. I just tell people the truth and if I can’t get the deal then obviously I can’t help you. So I say, hey, but look out, go get your deal and I hope you get that 100 before it. Yeah. We’ve had multiple conversations with people. You know, many times people call you back a lot. That wasn’t a right. you know, I would like to work with you. I got a deal the other day in memphis, but that one reason we like, you know, you’re going to offer us less, but we like you,
25:18 we like you. We know you’re going to perform. And one of the questions we started asking is, you know, so what happened or what did they say when you asked them to deposit the nonrefundable earnest. Oh, they didn’t
25:30 him haul backtrack, you know, come up with a story. Right? So I just tell people the truth and it seems to work. Tell me this, you guys seem again to have positive momentum. What are you think? What do you think are some of the, like the critical things that you’re doing well right now that’s leading to the momentum that you guys are creating?
25:54 Uh, well I think we have the right people. I’m max. I hired him, I want to say over a year ago as an isa. And he told me beginning before I even hired him, hey, I tried this whole selling thing. It hasn’t worked for me. Right? I was like, okay, hey, you know what? We can do it the other because I’m already doing it with the paper click, but then after that he said, hey, you know what, this whole selling thing is finally working. I’m gonna go do it on my own and say, hey, you know, what, go do, go do what’s best for you. I’m not upSet about that. And we stayed in touch and we reconnected to do max cash offers. Um, but I think we got the right people. And then I think that is just the personal development. One of the things I tell people, getting the real estate, the greatest benefit for me getting the real estate isn’t selling houses.
26:40 It isn’t, you know, income or any of those things is the opportunity to develop and grow myself. I’m a much better person today than I was 10 years ago because I’m in this business, uh, as an engineer. I was, believe it or not, a little arrogant, a little overconfident, a 30 hour week I was, I still remember woman managers saying, hey, we’ve got stephen covey’s seven habits of highly effective people were doing a workshop in the and, you know, does that intel, uh, it’s on this day from this time to this time, you should go check it out. and I was like, what? I need that for. I remember when I first met you, you said that they came to you and said, hey, we’ve got a special project. It’s going to be a little bit more, you know, after hours. And you said no, and you said the only reason why I don’t want it to go home, lay on the couch and watch a basketball game, no desire to do anything else.
27:31 Right. So, um, so back then that was my mindset. But man, you get into where you dictate your future and your income. Boy, you got to improve. And so I, I’ve invested a lot in person development. I still invest in lot of personal development. I’m going through sales training, entrepreneurial training, just traditional real estate training. And I’m also connecting with all these other people that are successful in the wholesaling industry and learning from them. But uh, the reason why I’m bringing this all back is that traction was one of the books that I read and that’s helped me run a tighter meetings and more focused. So on my traditional brokerage are traditional real estate team and our wholesale. All three are different traction meetings that we run every single, every single week consistently. And that allows us to focus on the rocks, focus on our, our, um, our metrics or kpis.
28:25 I mean, for example, this is something that max and I were looking at on monday. He said, hey, you know what? We cAn see the metrics for the last few months, the trends and say, well, we’ve been cold calling for two months and literally we have had no assignments from cold calling for the last few months. This is a problem, right? I’m likewise door knocking, you know, for the last two months we’ve had no second meetings from door knocking. This is a problem right? Since that one that we bought at the trustee sale, we haven’t had second meetings, so now we see opportunities to look at issues and say, where are we falling short? So then we changed, made some adjustments on the fly. Tell, tell, tell me one little thing that you noticed in two months of cold calling not getting a deal. What’s one little pivot that you made?
29:09 well, so we made an adjustment on the warm transfers now, so we had the cold caller and Mexico booking appointments. Now we’re saying, hey, you know what? You get a live one. You send it to max. Max is going to book the appointment and that’s one tweak we made this week. I think you hit on something personal development, you know, this year I started putting myself out there because I’m doing all this by myself and I started realizing I would rather make less money and surround myself with people that are going to challenge me than to keep going in the direction that I’m going in. That was one of the reasons why I reached out to you just to meet who you were. I didn’t know who I was going to find in each appointment. I haven’t figured out, you know, but, but I’m putting myself out there because there’s something about accountability and there’s something about good healthy competition that causes you to grow and you know, you start reading books together, you start doing life together.
30:03 I was just recently with, with jamil and it was my first time to ever meet him. I was so impressed. But what I was impressed with when I walked in and saw their whole thing, you could tell they do life together, right? They don’t just work together, they do life together. and that’s in my former career, why always built great things was I made it a family thing. And, and, uh, it’s very important because what it does is then you get this kind of holy fear inside of you. I better do a good job of leading, right? If I’m going to attach myself to already, uh, a good team. Yeah. Better, you know, develop. And I think there’s something beautiful about that. So, and I don’t know if bill wants us to put this out there, but if you guys haven’t had a chance, you guys need a tour.
30:45 Kigali in tempe. I mean, I walked in there, I told you I was blown away. Yeah. When I walked that office, you know, I was tempted to do a facebook live was like, ah, he’s out of town. I don’t know if I can get permission in time, like he’s doing whatever, but it’s an incredible environment. So it really is that there was music playing and stuff and we went in his office and shut the door. But I was just impressed at his transparency and his willingness to give me an hour and the midst of all their craziness. He didn’t check his phone 16 times. He didn’t look out the door 38 times. He just sat and asked questions and listened and I was very impressed. So, uh, with that, you know, obviously he’s got some, some pretty unique super powers. What would you say is a super power with you?
31:26 Uh, so it’s got to be either learning or, or I’m caring. I’m not sure which one it is that I was hoping you were gonna. Say that word fIrst time I met you. I said, how’d you go from one real estate agent to a broker with some odd 50 agents were over 60. Now. It’s crazy. You said one word and I went home and told my wife immediately. Yeah. So we’re deeply passionate and care about our agents and it’s so easy to just say, oh, I care about you. Right? Well, yeah, it’s easy to say but to live it and for them to feel it. and it goes back to um, you know, John Maxwell is good leaders ask great questions. One of my favorite books, I feel like a lot of us was kind of blend together but have all his books. that one’s my favorite.
32:10 great dude. But there’s three questions that you need that your people need to be able to answer and hopefully, hopefully I’m not butchering them, but do you care about me? Can I trust you? Do what’s best for me when, uh, when I, you know, I’m not looking and are you capable of leading me? And those three questions or something, I always had the back of my mind. Oh. And so when I’m working with my people, that’s always on my, on my, on my mind, and I think I’m fortunate also that I’m naturally that way. I think that probably being the oldest of six boys has a little bit of that effect, you know, being the first born. But will that laSt question is always in the back of my mind. That’s why I’m out seeking and asking questions of different leaders in Arizona is who could lead me.
32:56 I remember serving at a church, I was a pastor and I remember one of my leaders saId, you’re difficult to lead. And I said, is that a compliment or is. And he said it is, you’re just, you’ve got to bandwidtH, you know. And most people kind of just want to slowly go through on their Conveyor belt and you think and you want a challenge and you want to go where no one’s ever gone before. And that makes people nervous. Have you read the ultimate sales machine by chet holmes? No. So you should read that one. But that’s what he said, he was like, he realized like everyone kept complaining that he was awful to lead, but every time he works somewhere, he had doubled their production fedora 50 percent year over year consistently. and what he found was that by finding the difficult people is how you’re able to make massive changes and improvements.
33:46 Right. Without the difficult people. Like you want someone that’s just kind of comes in and does the job, then you’re not going to make massive pivots or switches or growing, but you get the troublemakers in there, which I feel like we’re pretty good surrounded by troublemakers. That’s how you make things happen. It really is. You know, you kind of. I was talking to another guy, he’s like, I go out and create all the messes. Yeah. And the rest of my team kind of cleans it up. We, we make money. Yeah. So, uh, what lesson would you want to teach somebody young in the real estate there? They’re young entrepreneur. What’s a lesson you’d want to pass onto them today? I think, I think you had to learn. I think you’ve got to grow. And I think one of the books I give to all our new people is the miracle morning.
34:27 Whether your miracle morning for real estate agents are just a miracle morning and that one does a pretty good job of capturing what you need, the mindset. But you got to keep growing because the world is going to pass you if you stay still. The minute you feel like you’ve got to figure it out is the moment you get passed. And one, um, one thing darren hardy always says, ranking, you know, or you want to make god laugh, tell him your plan. And that’s exactly it. If you’re not growing to stay ahead of everybody else, you will get past, especially with how fast things are changing today. I’m always hearing these new things that like, oh man, now we got to have that in our system because if we don’t have that, we’re so behind. But then let me, let me challenge that a little bit and said, but how do you not kind of chased the new thing so much that you don’t kind of keep treading towards the success?
35:18 You know, you’ve got a system that’s working, yes, I understand what you got to tweak and we get, but sometimes we get so focused on what somebody else is doing that we get off track and what we’re supposed to do and how do you kind of coach that so we don’t tear everything down, right. We add to it. Um, so I would say that’s definitely something that for the longest time people are always afraid of me going to conferences that particularly those two conferences. Going back to darren hardy, I went to two consecutive daren hardy conferences and both times I fired two people because he says he’s standing in front of you. He says, you know, there’s people that are don’t belong on your team. And right now you’re thinking about it and those people that you’re thinking about, you got to go back, get a firearm. Were they there at the conference with, you know, um, so, but there’s a lot of, you want to go back as a visionary and like implement wholesale changes. But we don’t, we make tweaks. And so when I come back from a conference, what I try to do it just write down, okay, if I accomplish three things out of these two pages I wrote down, that’s massive. And so we don’t want to tear everything down. It’s just subtle tweaks here and there.
36:25 Matthew potter said, true story. First book he handed me was a miracle morning and our production went through the roof and it was a good guy. It’s an awesome guy, you know, it was cool. I mean, that’s what I love about networking. I was, I was on a house with a short sale and hadn’t dealt with that much and I watched an interview. Yeah. And you were interviewing him and he waS the short. So guy. So I literally just reached out to him and the next thing you know, he, I got a three way phone call. We’re working a deal together with another wholesaler and he’s putting in all the work and gave me all the advice and uh, you know, props to him. So he’s an amazing guy. I’m very, very lucky to have him. Yeah, we’re, we’re trying to have lunch. Hopefully soon, matthew. So what’s the greatest lesson that you have learned? And I’m gonna I’m gonna
37:07 in the last five years. What’s the greatest lesson that you’ve learned and wholesaling the greatest lesson I learned wholesaling. I’m. Boy,
37:21 I’m going to tie this back to a comment I made earlier. Um, and I, I feel like at the same theme over and over again, but if you just network with other people and develop relationships, it really can help your business quite a bit. Um, so an intentional relationships, intentional networking, not just networking for the fun of it. Uh, I learned a lot about wholesale from jamil, you know, I consider him to be one of my mentors, um, but finding people that can help you grow, I think that’s, that’s the greatest lesson. It’s, we can get something more insightful, but no, that’s just, that’s the way my mind works. Sure. What are you learning right now? Uh, how to, how to get our brand out there. Uh, so right now this is one of the things we’re doing and it’s so fascinating to me that I feel like I’m still the same person that I have been for the last few years, but because of what we’re doing here with the podcast, with the meetups and intentional networking, you know, we’re getting their brand out there and becoming an authority in the space.
38:26 So that’s the, that’s what I’m learning right now. Now don’t you have an app? I do. So what does that, uh, so I created a app with my cousin wayne, a offer fast and what we felt was a need a little over a year ago, uh, for one place to consolidate all the wholesale properties because how many emails are you getting a day? And for a lot of those they just, you of get email blindness from them and we know statistically emails about 17 percent open rate or less. And text messages used to be the thing, but that’s kind of gone away. Uh, I know I was guilty over a year ago of starting to treat at text messages, emails. We’re kind of going through that pace or that, that direction, right? So we created an app so that you get push notifications. So, um, you know, we don’t know we’re there yet, but if all the wholesalers all put their properties there, then for a buyer it’s a lot easier for them and creates a better experience for them.
39:25 And from there they can, they can view the properties kind of like you have, you know, for zillow, you can view all the wholesale properties from all the different wholesalers. You can make offers on it, you can do messaging on it. Um, and we’re not there yet, but we’re going to have push notifications for your area. So that’s the focus for the rest of the year is being able to say, you know what, I only want to buy properties in a five, zero, one six. So you create a filter for if I own six and you get pushed up vacations anytime at eight, five, almost six property comes up. So we’re trying to create a better experience for wholesalers. Um, because right now it’s still a little bit of a free for all. A, I always tell people before that real estate was the most capitalistic industry of every, of everything in America, now that we do more wholesaling, boy,
40:11 that’s capitalism that way more capitalistic than traditional real estate. So what about, uh, so you got an app, you got real estate disruptors. I mean, what are you doing in regardS to coaching? Is that on the forefront? Is that something that interests you or
40:28 that’s something that we would love to do a. When we bought six, about three months ago, I say, you know, in six months I would like to start investigating coaching. Uh, but we already had people reaching out now and say, hey, you know, what, I’m stuck here or I don’t know what to do about this. So we’re finding that as opportunities present itself sooner rather than later. But yeah, definitely a passion for that because that goes right in line with my passion of, of helping develop people. So if I can help transform people’s lives, boy that’s, that’d be the ultimate
41:01 for, for what I’ve come out of and in my philosophy is there’s always somebody ahead of me. But there’s also always somebody behind me and so it’s kind of an image of I’m holding their hand in their hand because I feel like once I’ve been empowered, once I’ve been educated, I’ve got to figure out a way to pass that onto someone else. Um, so that’s, that’s huge. I mean, if I could get where I want to be in my passive income, I’d probably at this sounds crazy and I probably won’t, but I’d stop just so I could focus on that if I could wake up and make other people’s day better. That a truly what excited me. That’s the part of wholesale and then I do like is, is that getting in that conversation with somebody who’s hurting and they don’t feel like they have a way out. so what’s your favorite best or maybe even most interesting failure?
41:47 Uh, so when I first started real estate, I signed up for everything. So when people are asking, are some of the agents, you know, I’m thinking about signing up for this and for that I was like, talk to me first because there is an opportunity to spend it. I’ve probably spent it so racked up a lot of credit card debt when I first started and I would say that’s probably the most interesting failure because It got to the point, and this is back in 2008, 2009 where the credit card company, he said, steve, you have so much credit card debt with us. We don’t think you can pay it off, right? To wish I had every intention of paying it off, but when they say that, I said, you know what? You’re right. Let’s settle this. So, um, and that took a while, right? Hurt your credit for a little bit.
42:29 Sure. But, hey, if you’re willing to take less, you told me you want to take less, I’ll give you less. Sure. Um, but I would say that was the shiny object syndrome and I still battle it today. Shiny object syndrome hasn’t gone away, but now there’s a voice in back in my head that says, hey, you know what, this is, makes sense. And I’ll also incredibly blessed that I’ve got a wife who not only supports me but also keeps me out of trouble. Like the, uh, I, I’ve joked sometimes, you know, it’s the husband’s job to go out and find trouble as the wife’s job to keep us out of it.
43:02 Yeah. my wife would disagree, but I get us into a lot of trouble. Um, so let me, I want to circle back on something because it did make an impression on jeremy and I, you say you said this and that’s actually what attracted me and share me to your tribe is you care. Yeah. Um, what do you think it is in your life deep seeded that causes you to care? Not I care for people so my business can be successful, but maybe I’m being a psychologist here, but why do you care? Like what do you think it is that started at a young, early age for you to cAre about people as opposed to looking at them as profit?
43:41 I think it has to do with my upbringing, culture, you know, I think, uh, I had two parents who always told me that if anything happened to them, I was personally responsible for the five younger brothers. NoW fortunately, and they’re all successful, but that was what I was raised with was that you have this responsibility, we’re investing in you. Right? Um, they helped me, you know, obviously live with them through high school. Uh, I, they pAid for my car when I went to college. Now I had a scholarship, so they said, you know, if you get scholarship, we’ll buy you a car. It’s like a scholarship. They bought me a car, but they supported me through college and then I went to grad school. So I moved to California. Fortunately for grad school I also got a fellowship where they paid me to go there, but they were still supporting remotely.
44:32 But again, it was an investment where if anything happens to them, like I’m responsible for everybody else. And then there’s also an, they did this since I was like three or four, probably earliest ones. I can’t remember it any earlier. And I do the same thing that my kids is that, hey, we’re taking care of you now, but you just know when we’re old you are responsible for us. So there was always that lesson responsibility. I don’t, I’m not saying they didn’t do it with my other brothers, but I don’t think it was the same extent. In fact, I’ve, I, I’ve given my parents when grief because if I didn’t get straight a’s, boy I don’t go home, would not have straight a’s and then they were a little bit lax with my younger brother is say, oh, so either you’re unhappy with how I grew up, how you raised me or you’ve decided you want. The young ones will be failures. Which is it? And they didn’t like that conversation. Yeah, you don’t get grades.
45:26 So I have five kids and four of them are still in high school. In grades are important to me. Probably not for the same reason for a lot of people, but I’ve always taught my kids, I want you to get the a because it’s a process. I don’t care about the Letter grade, but it’s the process in getting the a, you’re going to use that for the rest of your lie. You got to go sit at a job or build a team and you might not like everybody, but you still want an a plus outcome. So what are you willing to do? How flexible are you willing to be to get what it is that you want, even if you don’t, because I got tired of hearing. I don’t like the teacher, I don’t care. That’s who god put in front of you. Find out what makes them tick really, which goes back to wholesaling. If you really do a good job of listening and find out what makes someone tick, you’ll be able to help. So I do commend you on that. You, uh, I continue to watch you just to see if he fake cares or cares, but it does seem that you really do care. So I appreciate that. So two questions real quick. What are you reading right now?
46:27 Uh, I’m not reading anything at this particular moment because people, because right noW I am, I am knee deep. I’m doing some sandler training right now. I am knee deep in that and I am all in on that. I mean, I am going to classes three times a week, I am listening to audio in my car. That is, where are you going to classes? Uh, so there’s a sandler facility up in scottsdale to chemo center and 90th. So brad ferguson is all super awesome dude. But like I thought I was saying earlier like sales training, I, this is re mapping everything I know about sales. So that’s all my energy. That’s good. Isn’t that favorite book
47:05 or, or what’s a book that everybody should read if they’re thinking about wholesaling and real estate? Yeah, investing.
47:12 So this goes back to traction and it’s universal, but I think traction is a great book. UM, and then for the visionaries, a rocket fuel to learn how to deal with people that are reading traction that, that need traction. Um, and then one of the bookS I gave, I gave two books to everyone and organization. One was delivering happiness, which is tony shay, the guy that founded zappos and sold it to amazon. And that’s something that it’s all about service. Everything starts with service and that’s one of our five core values. But the most important of our five core values, um, and then a miracle morning and think and grow rich is still one of my all time favorites. But so many people say they can’t get through it. Why do you think, uh, last question for me, why do you think people, uh, you, you’ve done a great job of putting people on the show and asking great questions and they’re doing well.
48:07 But why do you think people fail in this industry? I think it comes down to grit. I think it comes down to the willingness to do what other people won’t. There’s someone that someone wrote a great article or journal, but you know, uh, if you want to succeed, do what other people are not willing to do. Um, but I think that right now we’ve got some amazing young people in wholesaling today and you know, thank goodness that we have those, those young hustlers, but we’ve traIned a lot of people to, to, to not expect greatness. Um, or expect greatness within yourself. This is something that’s, you know, preposterous. But when I was in first grade, this is the beginning of give everyone a first place trophy, right when I was in first grade I was, we were in a contest, it’s not Turkey trot, but it was one of those things, right?
48:58 And one of the events was who can get the fastest from here to point a point a to point b right at the finish line with an egg on the spoon. ThiS is one of the four or five events. And I totally cheated and put my thumb on the egg and ran. Totally cheated, totally got busted. Right? You think you’re smart at six years old, you’re not, you’re not right. So I got busted cheating and after the event was over, I got a blue ribbon. I said, what’s this blue ribbon for? and you say, oh, everyone gets a first place ribbon. Yeah. I looked at her, took that blue ribbon and just threw in the trash can. And I’m a little competitive. right? Yeah. um, so I think that right now a lot of people are allowed. I’m not saying I’m not allowed or allowed to fail because I want everyone to embrace failure like you have to fail to be successful, but I think they’re failing without gaining any of the benefits of failing in that.
49:55 And that’s wheRe I’m saying fail with accountability. Yeah. If there’s some type of accountability built in, you’re held to a standard of how you felt. Let’s learn. Let’s move from that. But with no accountability. Yeah. So he tried hard and I tell people I don’t want to be a swamp. I want to be a river. I need those two sides. Right? Because that causes me to flow. It causes me to move and even move with purpose and power. But you remove those boundaries and I’m just a nasty, smelly swamp and one wants to be there. Right? Yeah. And yeah, so I don’t, I don’t think people know how to learn or grow from failure. Good word. Well, hey man, I, I’ve enjoyed it. I appreciate you letting me throw this idea at you and uh, and uh, do this. I think people did want to hear from you.
50:44 I think you are building something that is desirable to be around. I think people would benefit from the app. I think people do benefit from the show every week and I think there’s more to come. So I just wanted to say thanks for letting me do this and. Oh thank you. Yeah. Thank you for, for suggesting this. Yeah. Well you told me. I said no, no one wants to hear this. I like doing stuff different. If someone’s vegan that I say we should zag. Yeah. No. So I just thought hey, it would be just something different so I’m going to turn it back over to you here for the end. Alright. Thank you guys. Thank you. And do please tune in next week. We got chris iman. He’s one of the godfathers and the wholesale for the hard money side. He’s been doing it for a very long time, so he’s going to give us perspective on how he survived the last to turn around. And then we do have our event next thursday. I think it’s the six, 4:30. I make fake brewery, so be ready to attend that. And then download the app, you know, we, we, we love for you guys to gIve us some feedback on the app and what we can do to make it better for you guys. So with that, thank you guys for watching and thank you for this. This is awesome. Yeah, I appreciate it.
Elijah shares how he’s branded himself as the fire damage expert and has moved over 750 properties in his career.